I accept the idea that we evolved consciousness over a long period of time and that it ultimately caused our "separation" from nature. It does make me wonder about indigenous cultures though, since it's clear that they, generalizing of course, see/saw themselves as part of nature. If we accept the fact that our brains are essentially the same, why does there seem to be an earlier break for the rest of us? They had language, tools, art, etc., so is it simply because there lives were less abstracted from the real world, or something else?
Evolution of Consciousness and Indigenous Cultures
- Thread starter SamEyeAm
- Start date
cannibal cop
Grimscribe
This "separation from nature", as I understand it, is the development in humans of the degrees of self-awareness that, in theory, distinguish them from all of the other forms in nature. An idea I don't find wholly convincing, as it smacks of a kind of special pleading for humanity. All animals struggle to alleviate their suffering just as humans do, though nonhumans typically have far fewer options at their disposal for this purpose. And though it is a common belief that other animals do not share the human capacity to comprehend personal mortality, they show just as much concern for self-preservation when faced with an overt threat.
Ultimately I don't believe it is self-awareness so much as a well developed moral intuition that causing suffering is wrong (although, of course, this has never stopped most anyone in all of human history) that sets our species apart.
Ultimately I don't believe it is self-awareness so much as a well developed moral intuition that causing suffering is wrong (although, of course, this has never stopped most anyone in all of human history) that sets our species apart.
Knygathin
Grimscribe
I believe elephants do that as well. And probably whales and dolphins. And gorillas and the greater apes likely have an intellectual sense of it as well.
And I think some other animals, with less evolved intelligence, especially among mammals, still have a relationship to aging and mortality, an awareness that is more subconscious, but still experienced and sensed, and "grieved", among their social group.
cannibal cop
Grimscribe
One morning on my way to work I passed a pair of common pigeons in the street cooing and bowing and acting very deferentially towards a small white dove in their midst that might have been their offspring. When I returned later that afternoon, the dove had been smeared across the road by a passing car and two pigeons were perched on the edge of a roof nearby, gazing down at it and warbling mournfully, as if grief-stricken.
Knygathin
Grimscribe
Another thing, I don't think common people in general think a whole lot about it; the scientists have told them this and that, and the priests have preached to them about "dust to dust" and "the Eternal". This programming isn't always all that effective. From time to time they feel fear or anxiety over mortality, but most of the time they are occupied with daily living. When someone dies they weep, and miss, and so does many other animals. It is not really an intellectual thing, but a deeply emotional one. And we don't comprehend it very well.
I agree that the lines get very blurry here, and folks have made excellent points and observations regarding animal awareness, emotions, and consciousness. I think many of us get that we are still part of nature but that's mostly on a rational level. Few of us live and feel this in our daily lives. We've created and defend an abstract world that rewards greed and self interest. For example if society was working as part of nature climate change would not be the issue that it is.
I was curious about how we got here. Maybe it's evolutionary, maybe it's just cultural or psychological I don't know. It seemed to me that indigenous peoples, who's survival was directly connected to nature and community might represent another branch in this process.
I was curious about how we got here. Maybe it's evolutionary, maybe it's just cultural or psychological I don't know. It seemed to me that indigenous peoples, who's survival was directly connected to nature and community might represent another branch in this process.
Sepulchral
Mannikin
Think of an ape who has no one to see, nowhere to go, nothing to do and no one to know.
Now compare that to a human who has no one to see, nowhere to go, nothing to do and no one to know.
The ape will just sit there in stupid contentedness. Ataraxy.
You humans on the other hand....
Now compare that to a human who has no one to see, nowhere to go, nothing to do and no one to know.
The ape will just sit there in stupid contentedness. Ataraxy.
You humans on the other hand....
bendk
Grimscribe
"Stupid contentedness" as opposed to our delusion-creating machines humming away on overdrive?
